My wiring plans

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Re: My wiring plans

Postby MtnDon » Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:46 pm

The standard auto alternator puts out 13.8 to 14.2 volts; they need to in order to charge a battery. So every normal auto accessory will work up to that range and likely to work up close to near 15 VDC.

Depending on the aftermarket accessory there may be some danger IF the battery is being run through a battery charge equalization charge. Most common chargers can not do this so that may be a moot point. IF there is a 120 VAC charger or a solar controller than can perform an equalization charge that can change what is safe to do and with what. EQ charges can run up to 15 to 15.5 volts. There are some inverters that can be damaged by that high a voltage; read the specs.

As Tony said low voltage is bad for the battery. A regulator can't boost low voltage so low voltage is just time to turn things off.
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Re:

Postby ukewarrior » Thu May 14, 2015 9:39 pm

Can someone tell me the difference, for our use, in this Square-D breaker and these very inexpensive panel mounted breakers?
Other than the 15A vs. 20A rating. Won't they both do the same job with proper mounting and protection?
Any reason you can't mount the panel mount breaker on an electrical box with cover?
I'm thinking the units below are what's used in fused power strips.
http://www.bgmicro.com/FUS1003.aspx
http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G19437

bdosborn wrote:Kerry,
Here's a picture of the circuit breaker I got. Its the same size as a regular 20A panel mounted breaker but has mounting feet and covers for the lugs.

Image

Definately saves a lot of space over having to mount a box for a circuit breaker. The bottom cover is off so you can just see the lug underneath. I ordered a ring terminal kit to replace the lug but it hasn't come in yet. I'll still need some sort of cover for the end as you could stick something in there and hit the lug. It will also mount on a DIN rail. I got the high magnetic inrush model in case I add air conditioning sometime in the future.
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby ukewarrior » Thu May 14, 2015 10:21 pm

MtnDon wrote:A regulator can't boost low voltage so low voltage is just time to turn things off.


Actually, you can boost a DC voltage. There are units know as 'boost' converters which can take one input voltage and increase it to another voltage. You do lose current when this happens.
The opposite is a 'buck' converter which drops a voltage, yet increase the current.
For values under 3 Amps, these units are very inexpensive. (under $2)
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby Camp4Life » Mon Aug 15, 2016 3:30 pm

Just wanted to post a word of warning on all the schematics I see here. The main fuse should always be the first thing coming off the battery, and be as close to the battery as possible.

I see most designs have battery -> master switch -> fuse. This can cause problems if the master switch were to ever get wet/break/short out. If there's a short at the master switch, your fuse won't blow. This can cause your wire between the battery and master switch to overheat/melt/catch fire, and possibly the same could happen to your battery, which is very bad.

Always go battery -> fuse -> switch (or whatever else in the rest of the system). For safety! :thumbsup:

Cheers! :beer:
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Re: Re:

Postby Bogo » Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:12 pm

ukewarrior wrote:Can someone tell me the difference, for our use, in this Square-D breaker and these very inexpensive panel mounted breakers?
Other than the 15A vs. 20A rating. Won't they both do the same job with proper mounting and protection?
Any reason you can't mount the panel mount breaker on an electrical box with cover?
I'm thinking the units below are what's used in fused power strips.
http://www.bgmicro.com/FUS1003.aspx
http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G19437

There are different methods for circuit breaker tripping. Thermal, it gets warm or hot, then trips. Magnetic, the field strength get to strong, then it trips. Magnetic are more reliable, and not effected by outside temperature, but cost more. Thermal breakers are cheaper, but less reliable. Most circuit breakers in power strips are thermal breakers. Whatever type you use, I'd suggest having a couple spares of each size you use unless it is commonly available in which case keeping around a spare for each size should do.

Panel mount breakers are what is standardly used on boats. BlueSea is a manufacturer that caters to the boating market. Prices are high, but many boating supply places handle their equipment. Maybe enough coverage to not worry about having spares.

I picked up my last set of breakers from DigiKey. https://www.digikey.com/products/circuit-protection/en They are an electronics parts supplier. Prices are good, they have a minimum order size, but they have everything.

TE Connectivity Series W57 https://www.digikey.com/products/en?FV=ffec07ea&stock=1 and W54 https://www.digikey.com/products/en?FV=ffec0dc4&stock=1 looks close to what you were showing. Other makers produce similar parts. They will mount into a simple hole drilled into a panel. Check the termination of the type you choose because they can vary. I prefer to use 1/4" quick connects which most of these are. Carling Technologies https://www.digikey.com/products/en?FV=ffec07e6&stock=1 has ones that can do both 250VAC and 32VDC.

I typically get TE Connectivity Series W28 https://www.digikey.com/products/en?FV=ffec00d5&stock=1 They are an inexpensive but reliable thermal breaker for up to 250VAC or 32VDC, and you can drill a slightly oversize 5/8" hole in a 0.03" to 0.06" thick panel, and mount them by just snapping into the panel. They also have 1/4" quick connects so wiring them up is easy. They will need a 2.5" or deeper box. Other types of breakers can go into shallower boxes.

Waytek Wire is a place that specializes in the DC wiring needs for vehicles and trailers. Their circuit protection page https://www.waytekwire.com/products/136 ... rotection/ Their price for bulk crimp on quick connect terminals is great. You could spend more getting two packs of 5 from your local auto store than 100 from Waytek. They also have spools of wire, tail lights, trailer pigtails, etc.

Yeah, a standard electrical junction box could be used for holding the breakers. Follow maximum wire loading requirements for box loading, and don't mix AC and DC wiring in the same box. I'd look at using some of the exterior boxes that have a more finished look to them. As a note, when making a wiring panel with circuit breakers, I try to keep input and output wiring separated.
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby low277 » Mon Feb 27, 2017 6:54 pm

Wanted to 2nd Bogo's use of Digital-Key and Waytek for wiring components. I have purchased from both regularly and I happen to work for a neighboring business to Digi-Key.
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby jp323 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:58 am

Here is a PDF layout I made for my teardrop, in case anyone needs it for their planning purposes!!
Teardrop Schematic.pdf
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Master Swtich

Postby tearlurker » Wed May 15, 2019 6:45 am

Probably a dumb question, but do I need a 30 amp master switch if I’m using a 30 amp inline fuse between the switch and the battery? Which switch would be ideal?
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby tony.latham » Wed May 15, 2019 8:41 am

I don't think there is such a thing as a dumb question when it comes to electricity.

if I’m using a 30 amp inline fuse between the switch and the battery?


But I'm not sure what you are asking. It sounds like you have a switch in the line between the battery and your fuse box?

Any switch has to be capable of handling the amperage rating of the wire (not the fuse). Since you're fused for 30 amps, I assume you are running 8 ga wire on that circuit? But to answer your question, if you decide you want a switch on an 8 ga wire, you'll need a switch rated for 30 or 40 (or more) amps.

One thought would be to remove the fuse and replace it with an inline circuit breaker like this, that is also capable of being used as a switch:

Image

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Re: My wiring plans

Postby tearlurker » Wed May 15, 2019 8:32 pm

Yeah I’m not sure what I’m asking either; these threads tend to go off on tangents throughout the years. What I was referring to was something someone mentioned earlier in one of their plans about having a master switch immediately after the battery. Someone else suggested having the master switch come after the circuit breaker (battery-breaker-master switch) I don’t know where I came up with 30 amps. I have a bunch of 12 AWG that I want to use which is rated for 15 amps I think. I’m going from the battery to a circuit breaker to my fuse block and then on to my lights and fan. I want to add a master switch but I’m not sure what to buy. For what it worth, I really like this site and have learned a lot from it but it really could use a good cleaning. Lots and lots of dead links, expired pictures and posts that reference posts that have been removed.

Thanks.
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby tony.latham » Wed May 15, 2019 9:50 pm

tearlurker wrote:Yeah I’m not sure what I’m asking either; these threads tend to go off on tangents throughout the years. What I was referring to was something someone mentioned earlier in one of their plans about having a master switch immediately after the battery. Someone else suggested having the master switch come after the circuit breaker (battery-breaker-master switch) I don’t know where I came up with 30 amps. I have a bunch of 12 AWG that I want to use which is rated for 15 amps I think. I’m going from the battery to a circuit breaker to my fuse block and then on to my lights and fan. I want to add a master switch but I’m not sure what to buy. For what it worth, I really like this site and have learned a lot from it but it really could use a good cleaning. Lots and lots of dead links, expired pictures and posts that reference posts that have been removed.

Thanks.


Something like this? https://www.amazon.com/Audew-Battery-Switch-12V-Waterproof/dp/B07DPNRWXW/ref=sr_1_28_sspa?keywords=battery+cutoff+switch&qid=1557977060&s=gateway&sr=8-28-spons&psc=1

A 20 amp toggle switch would work.

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Re: My wiring plans

Postby MtnDon » Thu May 16, 2019 9:10 am

A 20 amp toggle switch would work.

Just make sure the switch is rated for DC use. When disconnecting a DC circuit there is a much larger electric arc with DC than with AC. (AC is cycling 60 times a second from full power thru zero to full and back again. That makes the arc much smaller.)

If there is power flowing while the switch is flipped that arc can severely burn the contacts. It is possible to weld them shut. That goes for breakers too; use a DC rated breaker, switch or fuse.
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Re: My wiring plans

Postby tony.latham » Thu May 16, 2019 9:40 am

MtnDon wrote:
A 20 amp toggle switch would work.

Just make sure the switch is rated for DC use. When disconnecting a DC circuit there is a much larger electric arc with DC than with AC. (AC is cycling 60 times a second from full power thru zero to full and back again. That makes the arc much smaller.)

If there is power flowing while the switch is flipped that arc can severely burn the contacts. It is possible to weld them shut. That goes for breakers too; use a DC rated breaker, switch or fuse.


Don:

Thanks (as usual)! :thumbsup:

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